Sanity in Comments: A User's Guide

Well, it's been a rough week below the fold on this blog. Hard feelings telegraphed in epithets and all-cap shouting greeted the end of the closest contest in modern national primary politics. Despite the high heat, I did not delete a single comment. There are a couple of reasons for this: for one, I can tolerate a bit of cussin' and vitriol. It doesn't necessarily bother me and it shows readers have a bit of passion, even if some of it is directed in anger towards me. And secondly, this is a historic moment and I think that blogs in this totally-wired primary have become historical documents. Oh, I don't mean to suggest somebody ought to burn this thing on a disk for the National Archives. But I do think there's value in presenting (and preserving for a while) an honest record of what people thought in the moment.

That said, I'd really like to invite a return to comity herein. So, a few firm observations:

• You will convince no one of the merits of your argument by belittling their position. Versions of "Clinton lost, deal with it, fool!" or "Nobama! He's a shyster, you jerk! or "If you go for McCain, you're an idiot!" are poor writing and they bring no value to the conversation. More likely than not, these smack-downs in comments merely harden the positions of those being ridiculed. Note: I do not use actual comments as examples here, wishing to call no one out in particular. Indeed, I have sinned through my own fault, through my own words, in what I have done and what I have failed to do.
• The candidates themselves are tough, professional politicians. Each has strengths and weaknesses. Each combines vanity, venality and ambition with vision, commitment and policy. It makes no sense at all to impart an imagined purity on your candidate, while defining your opponent as some combination of the great villains in political history. Again, this will convince no one.
• A secular, bloggy version of "turn the other cheek" is amazingly effective in these heated back-and-forths. Maintaining a calm and unperturbed virtual visage will impress your friends and unnerve your enemies. Pour your vitriol (and this being politics, I realize that's the fuel) into good research and writing. Back up any assertions with links whenever possible.
• Praise your opponents freely. There is no way the candidate on the other side is evil through and though; therefore, it stands to reason, the supporters of that candidate have some inherent good in them. At the very least, they care enough about the political process to show up and argue about it. Now and again, they'll make a decent point. Be quick with praise.
• Lastly, generosity is a lucky charm. We have limited campaigns of our own on this planet, election day comes soon enough to everyone, and there's just not enough time to settle every score. Besides, improvement is the idea - of ourselves, our communities, and our country. So cool out, people. Cool out.

To celebrate these new, purely voluntary guidelines, here's a great comment from Mr. Mobi, who walks the talk in fine fashion:

I'm an Obama supporter from Illinois, so I've known about him for quite some time. As an older man, I'm not especially given to fawning admiration for any politician (I'm from Chicago), but in the case of Obama, I find his story and his experience both compelling and inspiring.

Today, Hillary Clinton showed all of America how a great candidate concedes a vigorously fought election with eloquence, style, and class.

I've said before, and I'll say again now, these are the two best Democratic candidates I've seen in my 61 years. During the course of the campaign, both candidates were subjected to, and, in some cases used, racist and sexist attacks. That said, this was one of the mildest, most congenial political primaries I've ever seen.

Think about it. We had two candidates whose positions on the issues were, at most, millimeters apart. They fought and scraped for 16 months, and we now have a winner. Hillary today asked her supporters to "not go there" with regard to rehashing the real and imagined slights of the campaign, but to stay focused on how important this election is. It's good advice, and we ignore it at the peril of our freedoms, because the alternative is John McCain.

Comments

[noodles]

This is an ism-less post of great importance that is weeks too late.

[Brett]

Just wished to express my agreement with the sentiment Mr. Watson. Though a supporter of a different candidate than yourself, I was always impressed by the degree to which you were always civil and thoughtful in your discourse. Thank you

[sher]

thank you for your keen intelligence; looking forward to your book. a field hand.

[tdraicer]

>We had two candidates whose positions on the issues were, at most, millimeters apart

That is where we disagree. Perhaps their position papers are millimeters apart, but you can tell much more by how they campaigned, and I submit that the differences between them on vital issues (like healthcare and social security) were quite major.

For me, it really comes down to this: I think President Obama will kill the best chance, in what is left of my lifetime, for a true liberal revival, and I'm willing to suffer through 4 years of McCain (who I do not think will be anywhere near as bad as Bush) to achieve that. A failed Obama presidency (or one thatwins a second term by "uniting" with "moderate" Republicans) will be worse in the long run than a failed McCain presidency (that McCain will fail I think we can take as a given).

I'm not being bitter-I'm just taking the long view, and judging what I think are the probabilities. I've no argument with those who come to a different judgement (I could be wrong about Obama and if he wins I certainly hope I am) but I'm not going to substitute your judgement for mine either, nor apologize for my conclusions.

[Tom in Texas]

Anyone who votes for this man in defense of feminism needs to reevaluate what fighting for women's rights means to them. I'll refrain from calling them idiots, but they are abandoning every principle feminism has stood for since the 1960's.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-1024927/The-wife-John-McCain-callously-left-behind.html

"Carol insists she remains on good terms with her ex-husband, who agreed as part of their divorce settlement to pay her medical costs for life. ‘I have no bitterness,’ she says. ‘My accident is well recorded. I had 23 operations, I am five inches shorter than I used to be and I was in hospital for six months. It was just awful, but it wasn’t the reason for my divorce.

‘My marriage ended because John McCain didn’t want to be 40, he wanted to be 25. You know that happens...it just does.’"

"Ted Sampley, who fought with US Special Forces in Vietnam and is now a leading campaigner for veterans’ rights, said: ‘I have been following John McCain’s career for nearly 20 years. I know him personally. There is something wrong with this guy and let me tell you what it is – deceit.

‘When he came home and saw that Carol was not the beauty he left behind, he started running around on her almost right away. Everybody around him knew it.

‘Eventually he met Cindy and she was young and beautiful and very wealthy. At that point McCain just dumped Carol for something he thought was better.

‘This is a guy who makes such a big deal about his character. He has no character. He is a fake. If there was any character in that first marriage, it all belonged to Carol.’"

"But Ross Perot, who paid her medical bills all those years ago, now believes that both Carol McCain and the American people have been taken in by a man who is unusually slick and cruel – even by the standards of modern politics.

‘McCain is the classic opportunist. He’s always reaching for attention and glory,’ he said.

‘After he came home, Carol walked with a limp. So he threw her over for a poster girl with big money from Arizona. And the rest is history.’"

[zeke]

Tom,

I agree in principle with your guidelines, but when faced with the onslaught of so-called Democrats claiming that they will sit out the election or vote for McCain, one must question either their honesty or their sanity. The tenor of their remarks leads me to believe that any attempts at persuasion would be fruitless - indeed, your own arguments in favor of party unity seems to have spurred them on to new rhetorical depths.

[Dan Leo]

Tom: Well and wisely said.

[Slappy]

I think sometimes a good four letter word is the best way to end an argument. Repeat: END an argument. Nothing makes a point like a good "F___ you." But I have to say that this primary has made the comments on this blog unreadable. I have no problem reading dissenting views or arguing a point but the debate has turned into a sad parody of itself. As a citizen who is far more liberal than most of the country, I am used to losing elections. Aren't we all? For some reason losing to a fellow Democrat is far worse then losing to a Republican. I know my frustration level rises as I read the nonsensical comments. I suspect the heightened drama is due more to the arguing itself than the points being made. I know I made one comment that was more about venting my frustration with the commenters than anything else. Im guilty myself. You run a fine ship Tom W. Your post was a nice way to kick off the next political chapter, the general election.

I still enjoy reading every post. Even when I disagree.

[blue girl]

Great post, Tom. I just loved Mr. Mobi's comment when I first read it and I'm glad you posted it.

[Joel]

so-called Democrats claiming that they will sit out the election or vote for McCain, one must question either their honesty or their sanity.

Why must you? It is possible, that your viewpoint on the situation is not the the only valid viewpoint and those who think differently than you may not be dishonest or insane. And if the tenor of the remarks leads you to believe you cannot convince them otherwise, why worry about it at all? Especially given your low opinion of these people.

[Redstocking Grandma]

I have successfully penetrated the enemy camp. I immediately established an account at mybarackobama, joined 10 groups, started blogging on feminism and the election, in order to help Obama supporters understand Hillary supporters and outraged feminists everywhere. Obviously the campaign has not thought through the dilemma of an influx of Hillary supporters into groups dedicated to viciously bashing her. Their new obsession is preventing her for being the VP. I like to debate, so I can thrive in enemy territory. Too many posters are still looking in the rear view mirror, but lots of people are combatting that. I hope all my blogging and email is clearing the way for my less combative sisters.

It’s easy to make a splash. Start a blog, join ten groups, and send your posts to all of those groups. There aren’t many bloggers. Since FridayI have received about 24 requests for friendship and mostly warm welcomes from individuals. I have been told I am smart, perceptive, brilliant even. Someone told me he would like to clone 18 million of me.

I am combative. I am taking on vicious Hillary bashing and heroically refraining from Obama bashing. I am getting away with it because she who laughs, lasts, and I blow away most of them as a writer. Besides I am a wise 62-year-old grandma who reminds them that my English husband is one month older than Obama. Any woman who can entice a man 16 years younger to leave home, job, and family and swim the Atlantic for her ain't a dried up old crone:)

In general, it is a safer place than many progressive blogs. I posted lightly at my old hunting grounds, Obsidian Wings. As always, I instantly became the new Hillaryeven though I am funnier than she is.

It has been a better experience than discussing politics with my 4 Obama-obsessed daughters in the last year. The more you succeed in not clipping your daughters’ wings, the more empowered they are to clip yours. I am using a pseudonym because my darlings don’t want anyone to know they are related to me. I knew they were wretches when they refused my entreaties to read Pride and Predudice for a decade. I, on the other hand, read it the day my mom gave it to me when I was 12. Ignoring Jane Austen is a more grave crime than supporting Obama.
Redstocking Grandma | Homepage | 06.09.08 - 11:53 am | #

[Ren v Stimpy]

LET ME GIVE THIS A TRY:

You mother******* are all going to die in h*** for your f*****g up this election. Ok...sorry let me try it again. Eat s**t and die you c*********s how could you vote for that f*****g fraud! There I think that shows a lot of improvement! Who do I see about getting a hug?

<>_<> VOTE YOUR CONSCIENCE NOT YOUR GUILTY CONSCIENCE

[mrmobi]

You run a fine ship Tom W.

Allow me to second that. Tom, when you came out in support of Hillary was about the time I discovered your blog, and I came here to look at your rationale for doing so. I found your reasoning sound, and I started coming back daily.

For me, it's time now to take a step back. I accept that I'm not going to be able to change the minds of folks who are, I think understandably, upset that Senator Clinton did not quite get there. There was a good deal of sexism in the reporting of the campaign, no one can deny that.

Going forward, it is my fervent hope that Clinton supporters will make it their business to take a long hard look at Senator McCain. I have no doubt that they will not like what they see, especially with regard to the way he has treated the women in his life.

Anyway, thanks Tom. While I've thought some commenters here were a little over the top, it was never as bad as at Talk Left or No Quarter (which has become, as far as I'm concerned, a hate site).

[zeke]

Joel,

I must question their honesty or their sanity because I come from a long line of Democrats, have been active in the Democratic party since the McGovern campaign, and count among my friends a large number of Clinton supporters who would never in their wildest dreams imagine voting for an anti-choice, pro-Iraq-war Republican like McCain. This leads me to believe that many of the anti-Obama posts here emanate from Republican trolls or people who, while not clinically insane, have become temporarily unhinged in their devotion to personality over party.

And believe me, I don't spend much time worrying about them at all.

[AnninCa]

I don't understand why anyone would question the voting decisions of another person, unless it's based upon a false perception. We're not all alike. Even those who were Hillary supporters are not identical, so we'll all be making our individual choices in the Fall. Voting for a candidate who is not particularly attractive becomes a much more detached process of sorting out priorities. It makes complete sense to me that some will prefer McCain if they are more on the conservative Democrat side, some will vote for Obama, some will vote Green, some will write in Hillary, and some will just stay home. All the emphasis upon unity omits the individual's conscience from the discussion. To me every voter should vote their own conscience and stay true to themselves, whatever that decision may be.

[Joel]

Well said AnninCa.

[Susie]

****I'll refrain from calling them idiots, but they are abandoning every principle feminism has stood for since the 1960's.****

Remarkable how solicitous Obama supporters have become of the feminist cause recently.

*****but when faced with the onslaught of so-called Democrats claiming that they will sit out the election or vote for McCain, one must question either their honesty or their sanity*****

It’s been a recurrent theme of the Obama side that people who really don’t care for their candidate to the extent of refusing to vote for him must be stupid, ignorant, racist, insane, delusional, secret Republicans, etc. I see it’s not going away any time soon.

I can certainly understand supporting Obama because of his inspiring personal story – after all, until quite recently his most significant political accomplishment was beating Alan Keyes.

[mrmobi]

I can certainly understand supporting Obama because of his inspiring personal story – after all, until quite recently his most significant political accomplishment was beating Alan Keyes.

Good one, Susie! For those non-Illinoians here, that was an amazing election. I think Obama would count ethics reform and transparency in government reform in the Illinois legislature above the win over Keyes. Keyes was nothing more than a placeholder for the wingnuts, and never in serious contention. Even in conservative downstate Illinois, we don't care much for people who disown their own children simply because they're gay.

[mrmobi]

I can certainly understand supporting Obama because of his inspiring personal story – after all, until quite recently his most significant political accomplishment was beating Alan Keyes.

Good one, Susie! For those non-Illinoians here, that was an amazing election. I think Obama would count ethics reform and transparency in government reform in the Illinois legislature above the win over Keyes. Keyes was nothing more than a placeholder for the wingnuts, and never in serious contention. Even in conservative downstate Illinois, we don't care much for people who disown their own children simply because they're gay.

[sadie]

I would further(and respectfully) add that mass generalizations help no one. Statements like "Remarkable how solicitious Obama supporters have become of the feminist cause recently" baffle me. Mass generalizations on the convictions and ethics of millions of people who supported a certain candidate(regardless of which) are not only divisive, they are inherently and obviously inaccurate. Not to mention-- keeping perspective. The little slices of "representation" on the internets are just that-- miniscule slices.

[zeke]

Susie,

Let me get this straight. You care about women's issues, but would prefer John McCain to Obama. And even though Obama and Clinton are in virtual agreement on how to solve some of the biggest problems facing our country, you would rather see McCain elected so that he can prolong the policies of the Bush administration in Iraq and install anti-choice Supreme Court Justices. And finally, in defiance of your favored candidate's calls for party unity and her avowed support for Obama, you prefer to sit on your hands. Excuse the mixed metaphor, butt you are cutting off your nose to spite your face.

And, whatever your IQ, that is just nuts.

[donna darko]

Why are you here if you don't care for our votes?

[zeke]

donna,

like Paul McCartney's grandfather, I'm a mixer. (Not to mention very clean.)

[Palomino]

@ Zeke:

Not saying I'm one of them, but some voters are more willing to risk 4 years of McCain to get 8 or more years of a Democratic president than they are willing to risk 4 years of Obama to get 8 or more years of a Republican president.

[Susie]

****And even though Obama and Clinton are in virtual agreement on how to solve some of the biggest problems facing our country, you would rather see McCain elected so that he can prolong the policies of the Bush administration in Iraq and install anti-choice Supreme Court Justices.****

I have no love for McCain although I’ll defend him if I think he’s attacked unfairly and I don’t think four years of him would bring the downfall of civilization. To me Obama is seriously underqualified even if he is on my side (more or less; one of the reservations I have about him is that he sometimes gives the impression of having no side but his own) and yes, I have real concerns about handing over the White House to a rookie senator with a negligible resume and a fine speaking voice. Believe me, I hope I’m wrong about him and if I am I’ll eat crow, cheerfully. And I'm not ruling out voting for him. But for now I'm securely on the fence.

****And finally, in defiance of your favored candidate's calls for party unity and her avowed support for Obama, you prefer to sit on your hands.****

Well, I liked Chris Dodd too, but Clinton was the best candidate left standing IMO. As for her endorsement, Clinton is a good Democrat and a practical politician who’ll do what she has to do. That's politics. It doesn’t necessarily affect my vote.

I wish Obama supporters had been thinking more about party unity when they were hurling abuse at Clinton.

Good to hear from you, mrmobi, it’s nice to hear from somebody on the spot.