Guitars R Us

So Steve-o and I had a couple of hours to kill in the Pacific Northwest during a business trip this week. In all of retail America, there is no place better for a couple of guys like us (and millions more) to blow an hour or so than the Guitar Center. For those of you who don't know the story, the Guitar Center is a major consumer phenomenon.

Here's the short story: In 1959 Wayne Mitchell purchased a small appliance and home organ store in Hollywood, California. By 1961, he'd changed the name of the company to The Organ Center. In 1964, Joe Banaran, President of the Thomas Organ Company, approached Wayne in search of an outlet to sell a new line of guitars and amplifiers, called Vox. The timing was right, and Wayne saw the chance to seize a new retail opportunity. He was in the midst of relocating his original Hollywood Organ Center location to a new site, and he agreed that rather than closing down the old store, he would stock it with Vox guitars and amplifiers. Wayne named the store The Vox Center. By the late sixties, it had become evident that the future of musical instrument retailing lay in guitars and amps, not organs, and The Vox Center was re-christened The Guitar Center.

These days, the company has a market capitalization of $1.3 billion and its stock (left) is a favorite on NASDAQ. It did $1.275 billion in sales in 2003, and now operates 135 retail stores plus the online megasite MusiciansFriend.com. In the last quarter, the company posted a profit of 45 cents per share on revenue of $354.9 million, beating analysts' estimates across the board.

But it's oh-so much more complex and fascinating than that. Because the real story of the Guitar Center is story is about demographics and this:

You see, this is the guitar that a friendly young fella named Mike handed me at the big store down by Westlake in Seattle. And man, the sustain on this baby - for the record, a Gibson Les Paul SG Custom - was just thrilling. Mike grabbed a chord, and we ran the sucker through a Hughes & Kettner zenTera Modeling Amp, and lit it up. I ripped into some Muddy Waters riffs and the entire store came to a stop, tipping their ears with an eagerness born of being native to the land of Hendrix, soaking in the blues I was laying down. (Steve claims not, but it's my dream, not his. He was off in the keyboard room. Enough said.) I let the last note ring, an open A, put the SG down, completed my business meetings, boarded a flight to Chicago, changed planes for LaGuardia, got a car home after midnight, slept a few hours, went to work, did some meetings, got home, and I just checked with my buddy Mike - that A is still ringing. To quote Muddy, I live the life I love and I love the life I live (much of the time anyway).

By now, you've sensed that a trip to the Guitar Center - and there's one about 2 miles from my house and another down on 14th Street, a simple express train on my lunch hour - is like a trip to the amusement park. And the management knows exactly what do do - put hundreds of instruments in large retail spaces (often former supermarkets) and let people come in an play them, for hours on end if they wish. Because someday, they will buy. And these days, guys like me and Steve and a millions of other Boomers can afford some of the stuff they lusted after when they were 17.

And Guitar Center always does it well. There are hundreds of electric guitars and basses, all the major brands, dozens of acoustics, a keyboard room, a drum room, digital recording gear and accessories galore. Yeah, it's a supermarket for gear - but you can taste everything, any time, and in any quantity. These guys know me - I get their email and the "guitar porn" catalogues on a weekly basis. I've got a Musician's Friend credit card. And I buy - not to extremes - but I browse, and I play, and I experiment, and I buy.

So now I've got my eye on that SG. It's pricey and I really don't need it, not this weekend musician. But you know, the stress and work level these days is high. And on the next trip I'll find another Guitar Center and some other friendly and knowledgeable sales clerk will hook me up with the SG again. And you never know...

Comments

[Tom K]

"You see, this is the guitar that a friendly young fella named Mike handed me at the big store down by Westlake in Seattle. And man, the sustain on this baby - for the record, a Gibson Les Paul SG Custom - was just thrilling. Mike grabbed a chord, and we ran the sucker through a Hughes & Kettner zenTera Modeling Amp, and lit it up. . . . I let the last note ring, an open A, put the SG down, completed my business meetings, boarded a flight to Chicago, changed planes for LaGuardia, got a car home after midnight, slept a few hours, went to work, did some meetings, got home, and I just checked with my buddy Mike - that A is still ringing."

Nice piece, Tom. The evocation of "Spinal Tap" --almost verbatim, if I recall it right -- is deliberate, no?

[Tom W.]

Yeah, I did have the amp set to 11....

[Steve-o]

...and as we drove away into the murky Seattle night, I could hear the stinging sound of the twenty-year-old GC staffers laughing their asses off at the pretensions of us two ol' geezers. Little bastards still on the upside...I hate 'em. Gonna grab my brand new Fender Standard Strat (or maybe my 30-year old cherry-red Guild single-cutaway hollow-body Starfire III) (or maybe my Rogue uke) and write a real bitter song about them. "Life On The Downside." Hell - it'll write itself.

[jackson]

Great post Tom, but the damn SG already, live the dream for me, if not yourself. I love GC for the same reasons as you, and I hate the staff for the same reasons as Steve-O.

[cheap bass guitar]

Right on! On a side note, I just got a cheap bass guitar through http://www.bassguitarstore.com/

[Anonymous]

Yeah , likely story !! About GUITAR CENTER .. that is ! My husband ... worked for this company for almost 4 YEARS !!!
The damn place literally ... put us in the STREET !
ALL THAT MONEY .. that Guitar Center brings in .. you know , the money you talk about here in your article ??? Well let me TELL YOU A THING OR TWO .. it certainly isn't to pay the hard working , dedicated employees of this company !! I CAN SURE TELL YOU THAT MUCH.
So ... where is all the money going ?
It certainly isn't going to pay his (Wayne's) BEST employees ! His DEDICATED AND LOYAL EMPLOYEES !!!
So .. you go ahead and BUY that guitar you want.
Just remember that WHEN YOU DO .. the money you pay for it .. VERY LITTLE OF IT .. is going to the person who HELPS YOU WITH PURCHASING IT.
We went as far as to call the headquarters of this company .. and spoke to a man named "Sammy" .. who is one of the big wigs there. Do you think that he .. or ANYONE ELSE in that place cared what happened to us ?
HELL NO. As long as my husband was doing the selling they needed , that's all that mattered.
To hell with HIM .. or his family !! Or the fact that a manager LIED to my husband so he would come to work there. Which .. is EXACTLY what put us in the street.
OUR STORY .. is long .. and sad. If you wish to know it , I will be MORE THAN HAPPY to tell it.
But , right now .. I think you and anyone else who shops at Guitar Center .. or has anything at all to do with Guitar Center .. should know what I'm telling you NOW. If you wanna hear my story .. just let me know at a later date.
I have NEVER .. NOT EVER .. been as miserable as I was when my husband was employed by this company. It kept BOTH of us stressed out all the time. They don't pay their employees !
Period. My husband made over 1 million dollars in sales in a year -- just recently. Wanna guess how much of that he got ? 3 percent. That's all. THREE LOUSY PERCENT. AND THAT IS ALL HE GOT.
So basically , he got 30,000.00 in a year. FROM A MILLION DOLLARS IN SALES ???? Where did the REST of that money go to ? The equipment certainly didn't cost 970,000.00 dollars !!
And my husband was just ONE .. out of MANY salespeople in the pro audio department. Guitar department is the same .. they are paid lousy too. They only get a small percentage of their sales. All sales people in Guitar Center are COMMISSIONED employees. They do NOT MAKE A SALARY OR HOURLY WAGE. So , after knowing this .. do you HONESTLY think .. this is fair ?
Absolutely NOT. No. It is NOT fair. It is NOT RIGHT. Not when these folks are selling this equipment for the prices they are ..
They should get AT LEAST .. 20 percent .. or more of their sales. I would say that 25 percent would be ok. But THREE ? NO.

The bottom line is ..
GUITAR CENTER SUCKS. And we will NEVER , NOT EVER .. STEP FOOT IN ONE AGAIN !
Which means ... NO MATTER WHAT .. we will BUY somewhere ELSE .. before we EVER BUY .. at Guitar Center again !
UNTIL THEY LEARN .. that good salesmen are hard to come by .. and until they learn .. that dedicated employees are hard to come by ... and until they learn .. that you have to PAY A PERSON WHAT THEY'RE WORTH .. their stores are going to CONTINUE to have HUGE turnovers .. never keeping ANY good sales people .. AND ... it is NOT GOOD .. to ALWAYS .. have someone different for the REGULAR customers to get used to when they come in to purchase something.
Eventually .. THEY TOO .. will get tired of it.
They too .. will get tired of getting use to one salesperson to deal with .. only to find that they have to learn to deal with someone else .. EVERY TIME THEY TURN AROUND. They too .. will start going BACK .. to the "mom and pop" music shops. Where .. if you ask me .. IS WHERE EVERYONE needs to shop again !!
Everyone needs to BOYCOT Guitar Center !!
Guitar Center has put these mom and pop's out of business .. simply from their OWN GREED.
But .. if it's one thing I have learned in my life .. it's that KARMA IS A BITCH.
Guitar Center has it coming. Believe me.

Anonymous !
Atlanta , Georgia

[mortgage rates]

mortgage rates http://www.mortgagerates-x.com

[anonymous]

I recently worked for guitar center and was excited to get the job. I soon learned that guitar center doesn't pay thier employees shit, along with splitting up thier work week so employees that have the day off during the week (which is about 98%) don't get overtime !!! I had 102 hours of time in a two week period and no overtime... my check was less than 500 dollars and I almost lost my apartment. My fellow co worker and good buddy had been at guitar center for almost a year and sold alot of stuff and never saw a commission check, on top of that, they screwed him out of his paid vacation. This company is a tiranical money hungry peice of crap that doesn't care about anyone but its owner. I hate guitarcenter and will never contribute another cent.

[GC wife]

Interesting reading these slammings of GC pay, etc.

First, GC does pay hourly, plus a commission. Not sure where you got your information that GC pays strictly commission. Care to tell us how your husband was lied to?

Second, GC does pay overtime, where it is required by law. Perhaps the state you live in doesn't have overtime laws. However, GC did get into quite a bit of legal trouble some years ago regarding unpaid overtime. So I know they watch it very carefully.

Working for GC is always an adventure. And being a GC wife is never easy. Long hours are the least of the problems. But you enjoy what you can in life and just let the rest go.

happy holidays to all, and I hope you enjoyed buying that new PRS. My husband says New guitar smell is like new shoe smell to women. ;)

[GCchump]

Are you kidding GCwife? You must be the wife of someone in some sort of management. I work for GC. Love the job but I must quit because well you guessed it. The pay. I work there now, because I do feel a responsibility towards my customers and I feel like the people I work with are family to me. That also being said I hate the competition. Its embarrassing to watch a customer walk in and see 4 different sales associates gravitate towards them with their "Is there anything I can help you with?".
The customer looks as If he is being bombarded. I know, they have confided this in me.

You are wrong about the pay GC wife. GC advertises that they pay hourly plus commision to its prospective employees. BUT BEWARE! Hourly is minimum wage. Commision is 10% of profit, and 2% of Gross Sale. Doesn't sound that bad though there does it? Well that isn't the whole story. What most people don't realize until they start working there is, you have to pay your minimum wage BACK to the company with your commisions. They call this fading your pay. So ok...
Suppose I sell an XT Live, and say it goes for 399.00 and profits maybe $75 or so... that means I get 2% of the $399 being apx $8.00 plus 10% of the profit $7.50...Thats about $15.50 I made on that sale....now suppose I only have lookers the rest of the day or customers who are simply buying picks or strings maybe some cables the rest of the day, and over all I only profit $200 and sell maybe $600 dollars worth of stuff for the day thats $32 I made in commision, however, I worked 8 hours at a measely $5.15 and hour. I did not make commision...shoot, I didnt even pay back my hourly. Im screwed. That is how it works. I gotta go to work now so I dont have time for an elaborate closing to this post. Just wanted people to really see the clear picture.

[GC#1PRO]

LET ME START BYE SAYING THAT I AM THE HIGHEST WRITING GUITAR CENTER EMPLOYEE FOR PROAUDIO IN THE ENTIRE COMPANY. I TO SOLD AROUND A MILLION IN SALES , I TO GET 3%. WHAT DUMBASS FORGOT TO MENTION IS THAT WE ALSO GET A PERCENTAGE ON THE PROFIT OF EACH PIECE. I MADE ABOUT 90,000 LAST YEAR. ON TOP OF ALL THAT FOR BEING THE SALESMAN I WAS I WAS REWARDED WITH 500 SHARES OF STOCK. IS THE WORK HARD, YES. ARE THE HOURS LONG, YES. IS IT WORTH IT, HELL YES. GREAT PEOPLE GREAT ATMOSPHERE. SO PLEASE GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT BEFORE YOU GO BASHING A COMPANY YOU OBVIOUSLY KNOW NOTHING ABOUT. P.S BE HONEST WE KNOW YOUR HUSBAND DIDNT SELL THAT MUCH. THATS LEFT TO SUPERSTARTS LIKE ME :) . EVEN IF HE DID , MANAGE YOUR MONEY 30,000 IS MORE THAN MOST THE COUNTRY MAKES. ITS NOT G.C'S FAULT, HE IS A GROWN MAN, TAKE SOME RESPONSIBILITY

[GC#PRO]

Wow , Gc chump is correct on the pay scale for a new guy. If you move up you do get higher percent. But if you can only write 200.00 in profit you would be gone in my store. My dog spot can do better than that. We deal with great customers with a great staff. If you dont like it leave, If you love the job it comes easy. I really wish i knew what location you worked at to see wich G.c is that slow in buisness,

[stan]

First off, I must state that GC#1PRO should return to some type of education to correct the many spelling/grammar errors that his statement contained. Second, the employee pay rate/schedule that GC follows is both extremely illegal and unethical. It will only be a short period of time in which the courts will find GC negligable for previous back-pay. Stay informed.

The employee pay rate/schedule that GC follows is neither illegal or unethical.

When new-hires come in, I explain it in terms of being a car salesman. It is set up almost the exact same way.

I wonder if wifey's husband had any certification in pro-audio. The higher your certification, the higher your percentage of sales.

It is explained to new-hires that they will make minimum wage for the first month. It is explained what fading is. Our average pro-audio salesman sells roughly 80,000 a year, not including x-mas. His percentage of profit is determined on a base and his certification.

If hubby wasn't selling enough, he probably didn't have the product knowledge (or certification) to do it.

For sales people in GC, the sky is the limit. You can make as much as you want.

[GCTruth]

This is to GC#1 writer. GC doesn't pay shit. Ask any employee in California what they were paid for Memorial Day.

GC paid employees regular pay for this Holiday due to a loophole they found in the law. The funny part is that they didn't even let the employees know they were not going to get Holiday pay for working that day until they were picking up their checks a few days later.

A good salesperson can starve at GC. I've seen it happen. I see people that can barely afford a car working there. That kills the spirit of the salesperson.

The pay is minimum wage and you have to pay this back by selling enough gear to cover the minimum wage you were paid. And by the way the sales commission scale is lower now. Even though the company was doing fine when commission pay cut happened.

I'm sure upper management took a pay cut as well. (LOL)

I have no motive here only to tell the truth.

The sad part about this all is that the people that work there are cool, but the greed of upper management is destroying the company.

GC needs to realize that the salesperson is the first and last impression.

Let's do the math on what you said you sold GC#1Pro. @ $1,000,000 sales

You get 3% of gross sales and 10% of gross profit-this is no longer true for GC new hires.

$1,000,000 gross sales x .03=$30,000 Plus
$ 200,000 gross profit x .10=$20,000 assuming a 20% profit margin which is kind of high and going off of the old pay scale which is cut now.

Total you made would be @ $50,000 less taxes @$35,000 NOT $90,000 Talk to me! Maybe you made a mistake on what you told us. 99% of the other salespeople did not receive stock, however I do believe you did because many top ten writer do.

[GCEmp]

Let me say this. I work at a secondary market GC. Around 5 million in sales per year for the whole store. I write less than $400,000 in sales a year and i am bringing in enough to pay all my bills, eat well. And own over $5000 in the best music gear out there.

I am an Assistant Manager and i have always been rewarded for all of my hard work. I make $5.15 and hour, and fade that and make close to $20,000 a year. Plenty for a college student.
GC offers many opportunities and if i want it, i could have a store in 6 months, and i'm almost 20. And be making $40k to $60k a year. And i have talked to plenty of men and women who are happy as hell doing that.

If you can't handle the stress, then go flip burgers. Have fun making $8.00 and hour and staring at french fries instead of guitars. I have learned more at GC than any other job i have ever worked. My store manager has taught me more about business and life than anyone else. And he can buy a Harley Davidson in cash.

And also to think about. Marty Albertson, CEO of Guitar Center. With full bonuses, makes less than 2 million dollars a year. The CEO of Mcdonalds makes closer to 4 million. Look it up on forbes.com, the CEO of Target stores makes 40 million a year. Marty's compensation is right at the median in the whole country. Management isn't taking all the money. Guitar Canter uses most of it's profits to grow. They aren't malicious. They built this company from a little organ store in Hollywood.

If you don't like your management, become the management. Thats how i became an assistant manager at 18. Don't get on here and cry because you thought you could stand behind a counter stoned and make money. You are upset because big bad GC took 3 hours of overtime pay from you. You could have made up for those few dollars in sales in 20 minutes. Don't bash on opportunity because it didn't work out for you.

[cg thingy guy]

I must agree with the GC guys. I just helped open a new store last month. I have worked my ass off and am almost making a commision check our first month of being open wich is very rare i hear. My singer just made a check for sure ( a fairley big one.) Also to add the the pay we are department mangers and all the payroll that is not used is Split between DM's and Am's. And although we are managers we are still sales people and make the same hourly wages. Needless to say we are a third rate store and not in a very populated area. I am very close to "FADING" and i (like one of the other posters" am in accesories selling strings and pedals.

[GCshopper]

I don't care whether GC#1Pro is telling the truth or not. If the highest producing salesman in the ENTIRE company only made $90k - then that just sucks!!! I was offered a job to join a GC here in Detroit but I know what my response is going to be now...NO!

[DrumDM]

I'm a drum dept manager in a smaller market and I have to agree with a lot of these people that this company does not pay enough commision for it's sales workers to truly have a living wage. Yeah, there are going to be slackers who don't make anything, and there will be superstars in big stores who can pull down huge numbers, but I know plenty of skilled people who work hard and barely scrape by. GC loses a lot of talented people because they have no choice but to leave. Is GC wrong...not really, no one forces you to work there, but a little corporate responsibility and loyalty to the average worker would be nice. If you didn't know any better you'd say this company was run by a bunch of money hungry Republicans...how un-rock 'n roll is that? It doesn't really take skill or ability to become a AM or store manager...just some decent sales numbers, the ability to kiss ass, and the willingness to let them transfer you whereever they want at the drop of a hat.

[GCmanager]

I run the audio department in the second largest store in the chain. On my way to Assistant Manager status then GC Pro when there's an opening. Been with the company for 2 years now.

Salesmen in Guitar Center are responsible for basically everything that happens in the store with the exception of cleaning the toilets. Yet we are solely compensated on sales. Now while you do have an hourly rate, you HAVE to pay that back out of your commission check. So, Even if I did work over time, but I was doing something other than selling, I'm earning the same ammount of money as I would without the overtime. And because it's 1.5x hourly, my commision check is even SMALLER.

Add to the fact that Guitar Center not only Inflates apparent cost to the sales men, they even flat out LIE as to what cost is. There are 2 types of cost on the GC employees screen. First is "dead cost" (Or Location average cost) and "Base cost." Dead cost is self explanitory (Though it's not as concrete as it would seem, but I'll get into that later. From dead cost you add freight, and then there's something called "ad pack" Now I've heard 20 different explanations as to what ad pack is but lets just say that they take 10% of dead cost and add it on top and that brings the piece to "Base cost" everything after that to the price you sell it at is profit.

Now, they say ad pack is used to pay for lights, radio spots etc. My problem with that is that ad pack IS PROFIT. It doesn't matter how you dice it up, ITS PROFIT that salesmen do not get credit for. To make matters worse, Guitar Center generally lies about what DEAD cost is!!! Generally theres ANOTHER 10% of inflation in there BELOW Dead cost!!! This much I understand because it keeps the company afloat, but there is NO EXCUSE for giving salesmen such shitty percentages when there is soo much money floating around.

There is an argument that upper management and gung-ho salesmen use when you're not making enough money which is "Sell more." This seems like a rational argument. Sell more = Make more. This is a flawed argument. If I cut the commision rates that salesmen recieve in half, the argument holds up. "Sell more and you'll make more" would still apply. But the ammount of work you have to do in this company to live comfortably is far beyond what you get paid for. Now I don't know how it is in other stores, mine is high stress and high pressure because of the location but I can't imagine it being different elsewhere. (Though employees on the west coast are paid less than the rest of the company).

2 days ago, an employee of mine came up to me to say goodbye because it was his last day. It came as a shock to me and I asked him:

"Why are you leaving?" To which he responded:

"I can't afford to work here anymore"

This basically sums up my experience as a manager at Guitar Center. GC has always had a problem with a lopsided talent pool and a high turn over rate. They just don't realize that they really can hold onto some truly great people and FURTHER dominate the compitition by taking care of their workforce better. Who would want to work for Sam Ash When GC pays well and is the winning team?

It doesn't make any sense.

Marty Albertson May take in 'only' 2 million a year but let me ask you this, when was the last time you saw $2 million. How about 10% of that? I didn't think so.

Steve Jobs takes $1 a year from apple.

The money isn't in the Salary my friends.

[GChater]

Guitar Center? Absolute scum. Like car salesmen but without the ethics or class. The bait and switch 'blowout sales,' the "we only have a floor model at that price," the rotten-to-the-core corporate environment -- from the suede-shoe local managers, through sleazy pinheads like Sunny Moir, and ultimately to Albertson himself.

Go to the website, get the price, and then have some company with integrity match it. Don't give your money to the jerks. Do a little research, and see if you don't find they're under investigation for illegal business practices in almost every state in which they operate.

By the way, EVERY email address at GC is first initial last name. Like malbertson@guitarcenter.com. Have fun with that!

[does not compute]

Hey Stan - how does that work out for the salespeople? You stated, "Our average pro-audio salesman sells roughly 80,000 a year, not including x-mas." Several people have cited 2-3% of sales and/or 10% of profit as the total pay. Which, if it's the same thing, means GC has only a 20% profit margin, which would explain how they can undercut all the ma & pa shops on price .... but that wage would compute to either $1,600. or $3,200. PER YEAR depending on whether those 2 amounts are added together or not .... Can you explain how the salespeople live on that????? Do they live off of others or do they have "side businesses" in which they make their real money???? Is this making sense to anyone?????? Just curious!!!!! Oh, and since there seem to be some math challenges on this page, that comes out to $66 per week!!! That's gross!!

If that's true, it sounds like a good case for investigation by the IRS - or maybe the DEA... or better yet, if you work (or worked) at GC, maybe you should contact the DOL on behalf of all GC employees, here's a place to start:
http://www.dol.gov/esa/whd/

[GC-TRUTH]

While a lot of information was covered many MAJOR points were MISSED and others were placed without context. Hopefully this will make things LOUD & CLEAR just the way audio pro’s like em.

PAY STRUCTURE (West Coast):

- Minimum wage with a commission scale as follows: 8% of Profit + 1 to 2 percent of Gross (Based on level of certification. The 10 & 3 days are gone).
- Concept of “Fading”… Basically - “If your not selling more than what it costs to have you here… Then why are you here!!!????” - Well you have to pay someone to be here it is your business but none the less that makes complete sense…. But wait… you fade out of YOUR portion of the sale! So in actuality its more like “Make ~95% more than what it costs to have you here and you will be eligible to START making commission for the month”
- Fading occurs over a months time. SO in the example given by the gentleman above where he didn’t fade for the day, he would have to make up for that loss.

PAY Depends On Experience??????

- Why does everyone make the same amount of money? The amount of knowledge and experience required to sell Pro Audio gear is 100 times higher than that of some one in any other department. Granted Pro Audio numbers are usually higher however in terms of overall paychecks Pro Audio staff do not make that much more than the guys selling picks. Why? Think McDonalds vs a car lot. While per transaction sales are higher there are less of them. Additionally qualifying, earning trust, creating relationships, negotiating, light training, and support are all required in pro audio sales. To make matters worse the PA guys have to physically move equipment from the warehouse to the customers car. This stuff is heavy.
- I think most would agree anyone with a HS diploma and an instrument background could work in a guitar, accessory, or drum department. I would go further and say any blockbuster video employee could work in those departments and get acclimated fairly quickly. Now…. Could this same individual have an intelligent conversation with a customer that involved computer hardware or operating systems or acoustics or mixing techniques or signal flow or……. Should I keep going? Do they have any experience working on a console in a professional studio? You need to have working knowledge of every product you sell, every piece of software, help desk level computer skills, experience in live sound, recording equip, DJ & lighting AND you have to know everything more than your customer knows. No one is going to buy something in the several hundred to several thousand dollar range from someone who doesn’t know what the hell the stuff does.
- What about the 1 hour before or after you shift when you’re doing janitor work? Why do you have to fade against that?

FORGET THE DETAILS THERE IS A REALITY CHECK NEEDED

- Next time you go to Circuit city – Sears – best buy – fry’s – etc look at the employee and think to yourself “This person makes more than the guy I go to for advice on the equipment I use to earn my living or the most expensive hobby anyone could have”

TOP SELLER GUY: Good for you! You made a billion in sales and made 500k last year!!! And good for the other top 20 guys that make 60-90k. What you fail to realize is that you don’t sell to everyone in America. Therefore most of America is putting trust into minimum wage workers. More over in your attempt to defend GC’s position you actually brought attention to the fact that someone “at the top” has no clue as to how important an issue such as this is to the buying public. What a weak mind you have… This should be an example to everyone reading this…

GCTRUTH: You’re a college student and happy you made 20,000…… That’s great but get back to school and let the adults talk. You are another prime example of the quality of employees GC has. That’s intern money in the studio world. You have ZERO business making recommendations on gear. Experience is required.

[GC_Employee]

Yes, this company is BULLSHIT. Basically, they all make us work for minimum wage with the ILLUSION of commission. No one ever makes a dime on commission, and if they do they are within the top 3 in sales and basically sold their hearts and souls out for a few hundred extra in bonus cash.

This type of thing should be illegal, they should go to a regular wage system instead of flat out stealing from our pay checks and saying we are commission based. THEY MAKE US WORK FOR MINIMUM WAGE AND THEY MAKE US ALL SHARKS BY LYING TO US ABOUT THE COMMISSION SYSTEM, SO WE TRY REALLY HARD FOR THE COMPANY TO SELL, BUT IN THE END IT WAS LIKE WE HAD A FLAT WAGE ALL ALONG, EXCEPT IT IS MINIMUM WAGE.

WOW CORPORATE MANAGEMENT HAS THIS DOWN PERFECTLY FOR THE PEOPLE ON TOP, THE SALESMEN ARE ALL PEONS IN THEIR EYES!

[GCEmployee201]

Ok, I work at a GC right now and love every minute of it. It frustrates me to see how many people compain about a company that is amazing. Sure the pay could be a little better, but I am sure that you complained while flipping burgers at McDonalds that you should get paid more. There is always oppertunity for you to make more money and as for fading it isnt as hard as you would imagine. The phone is your friend learn how to use it and see how much more successful you become. The managment treats me like a member of GC not just another worker. My opinions matter and they make me feel that way. To complain about a good thing is pointless and says something about your character. To be honest with you its easy work. Retail isnt for everyone so all those whinning, start winning and sell more or go to fast food or a store where you can stand there. Thats my rant for now.

[016...]

Well this is a sales job. You do have the right to make what you want with it. Ya it ain't much but, then again the customers allways seem to want to pay less too. Funny thing that. People seem to complain that we have a high turnover as they grind me for a discount.
I work 40 hours a week and make about $3500 a month consistantly. It is not that hard. Consider other sales jobs where you may be on call 24/7 and earn more but, never have a life. You may sell cars and not get to be around your hobby all day. You can go pound nails for $25 an hour if you have the experience and back for it. You can go to school and become a.....
The question is do you enjoy what you do?
Me? Yes I do.
If you work for GC or have and hate them for the pay...next time really ask and do the math before you take a sales job.
I have made 4 times the income and hated it. Yes I would be full of it if I told you I would turn down the same amount of pay with this job but, it is not there, too bad. That company too added a pad to cover the cost of doing business as do most companies that sell things. Great thing about publicly traded companies is that you can go check that info out. Please do.
As for GC... Well when I was a kid we paid list price or had to spend hours arm wrestling some greasy manager over the price so this is a wonderful option compaired to that.
To the customer. Thank you for buying from us instead of some non store on the internet. We will be there , in person, for you when you need help with Sonar 6 or changing tubes or just finding the right gift for your 5 year old grandson to play around with Grandpa on.

[former employee]

Guitar Center sucks, plain and simple. I was hired for a grand opening store in the guitar department. We met at this hotel for a couple of weeks where we learned how to be douche bags and say things like "Cool boots, dude. Are those snakeskin?"

They lied and said how much money everyone would make. Yeah, 2 weeks and 110 hours later, you got a check for $500. It was the classic 'bait and switch.'

There was no real closing time. It was whenever the faggy managers decided you could go home. Forget about playing in a band if you work for these unethical dickheads.

There was this queer dude named "13" that would come in and cheerlead you and say "dude" so many times, Bill & Ted sued.

It's a job for little kids, or guys with ponytails and no lifes. The people here who defend GC are the most annoying people you could ever meet. That's how they get by at GC. They are lifeless, pitiful fartfaces who get made fun of as soon as they are out of earshot, by customers and employees alike.

[guitar-trader]

Guitar center doesnt suck! They have some good deals but i think we are better.

[Bayesssplyr]

Let's get some facts going on just how great GC must be to work for. From the July 2005 issue of Business 2.0:

"It's no surprise, then, that GC sports one of the highest annual employment turnover rates in RETAIL- 95 percent, compared with the industry average of 60 percent."

Yes, this means GC has fine quality salespeople from which I would like to purchase my musical equipment from. The guy selling basses at GC has a better chance of making a living at WalMart. Sad that the majority figure this out rather than the few ass kissing GC suckups on this page.

[Nate Dogg 918]

95% turnover is ridiculous in any business... from the aspect of "what it takes" to hire someone, financially... GC would actually probably save money by increasing employees' take, either by reducing the fade to a percentage or upping their overall commission, how? Turnover is VERY expensive. If they were to retain another 30% of employees and get closer to the national turnover average, the money they'd save with retention would cover the additional compensation they would pay out to their NOW happier and more loyal employees. A happy salesman is a better salesman. Selling to just make rent is NEVER as much fun as selling because rent is covered and you've got an eye on a SG Custom....

[Drave]

First off, I worked for Guitar Center for 2 weeks. This came after I worked for ANOTHER music store chain for over a year. I decided to apply to GC because I had become nostalgic over my original job, which I had to leave because of relocation.

Lo and behold, GC sucked balls. At each of the my three interviews, the managers gave me different pay details. At the final interview they told me the truth and put me on the spot (Do you want it or not, cause we have like 40 other prospective employees?). I was desperate and still clinging to the hope the job wouldnt suck, so I accepted. Big mistake.

The above posters are correct about the pay rate - youre paid minimum wage hourly, two checks per month. Your third check (commission) is supposed to be your 'bread and butter,' but they subtract the hourly pay from your commission total. And commission for new employees is 1.5%. After the company's endless certification sessions, you can make 3% on the sale, which is still crap after the hourly subtraction.

Now dont get me wrong, if you work in pro audio (where everything is several hundred dollars) and youre a slick salesman, you can still make a good paycheck. But if you work in drums like I did, unless you sell multiple kits a day, youre screwed. Sticks and cymbals arent gonna pay the bills honey. Everyone is far underpaid for their work.

At my original job I was making a decent hourly wage PLUS commission (which was brand dependant), which meant a good paycheck. GC puts tremendous stress on their salesman to move product (including multiple sales briefings daily), and when you dont make a decent check they just reply that 'you arent selling enough.' I know the product, know sales, and still ended up flat broke. The only difference was the company.

In conclusion - GC owes me two weeks of my life back. They make it very obvious in meetings that all they care about is profit (and their profit margin is ridiculous), and now theyre rolling out 'product service plans' like Best Buy. YOU try selling a service plan on a drum, people arent stupid. Management sucked, their 'sales tactics' sucked, and I was unimpressed. Ive personally stopped shopping at GC and now buy my gear at smaller local shops. Even with the higher overhead costs of a Mom and Pop shop, I pay about the same price for gear as GC (who buys in bulk).

[hime]

Ok- Let em just say that we all need to stand up for what is right- sort of like the musicians that will play those wonderful guitars that all of the salespeople show them. If you are not getting fair pay for THE YEARS OF SALES EXPERIENCE THAT YOU HAVE- and I have worked for fortune 500 companies in sales and was within the top 15% of a group of 500 colleagues, (in case you may ask what I may know regarding sales. If you aren't successful at sales, YOU WILL NOT STAY IN SALES LONG ENOUGH TO EVEN HAVE INTERMEDIATE EXPERIENCE IN SALES. So, when you write- deciding whether Guitar Center is ripping people off, or if they are being fair- please consider that people deserve pay at the rate of their experience. However- WE NEED TO REMEMBER THAT IF WE KEEP SAYING, "stop complaining", that the companies will, naturally think that we, as US citizens don't care much about that little thing called MONEY- and they will pay us less and less of it- OR OUTSOURCE IT TO ANOTHER COUNTRY- where they can pay less. On the other hand- if we aren't fair either- they will outsource it more likely, also. SO, let's all be fair to each other- hear one out- and - to the CHUMP SALESPERSON- (gcchump) forgot to realize was- any salesperson can figure him out- if he doesn't realize that- a real fortune 500, or greater, company- (one that has been in that status for a good amount of time, as well)- would pay an awesome salesperson- like he TRYS to CLAIM that he is- much better pay than what he is bragging that he gets. So he works hard to get peanuts. HAve you ever seen the squirrel "SCRAT" on ice age? He sure works hard for what he gets- and he is funny doing it- but does that he is smart?

[Annon]

Guitar Center SUCKS. I have spent thousands dollars there before I wised up to there business practices. So about 2 years ago after I got pissed off at them, I decided to even up things a bit. I purchased a 52 Refin Tele and a A early 60's Jazzmaster and a few Pre CBS amps. Played em for a bout a week and then took em all back within a month of buying them. Got all my money back. Then they changed there policy on Vintage returns, instead of 30 days now it's only 24 hours. Don't know if they did that to me or maybe its now Company policy. I don't give Damn 1 way or another. I HATE Shitar Center. Recentley went into a new one in LEXINGTON, KY. And there fucking computers were down. So, I had to wait in about 20 mins just because the stupid idiot salesman had to take all the information down from other customers purchases. Now after waiting all this time just to have a chance to buy some fucking guitar strings, the dickhead salesman wanted my information? I saidI'm not about to give out my info for a $5.00 pair fo strings. He said I have no option. I said yeah I do I just wont buy the strings. I walked out pissed and I gave the young annoying punk that stands at the front of the store a piece of my mind as well. I said your store sucks, it is a new one you know. He said its not my store defiantly. I said Fuck you and Guitar Center and was onmy way. I hope GC goes broke. FUCK YOU GC

[Dude]

Annon, for your convienience, here is a list of reasons that you represent what's wrong with humanity, or at least American culture:
1)You returned everything you bought, which you seem to think slights the company in any way. It doesn't. It wastes the salesperson's time, and time is money when you are on commision.
2)You say you waited 20 minutes as if that's the end of the goddamn world. Their computers were down? Try to be a reasonable person and not a raving idiot for a second. Have you ever personally opened a store with millions of dollars of inventory and complete network integration through corporate intranet? There's gonna be some speed bumps. Sorry we kept you away from whacking it for half an hour.
3)You were short with the salesperson who was, I'm sure, also frustrated with the computer at the time. I assure you he was not delighted at keeping your very unpleasant self there. Also you said "fuck you" to the door person? Are you insane? What did they have to do with you, the computer, or anything involved with your situation that day? They are just there to greet you when you walk in, and make sure you don't steal shit on your way out. What store these days doesn't have those guys?
4)You seem to be relishing in hating GC because you think big corporations are out to get the little guy. Keep in mind that GC, Target, Wal-Mart, and any number of massive corporations these days all started as small businesses. You hate them for being successful? Also, if Guitar Center wasn't around to provide you with their extremely streamlined inventory system, you would have a significantly harder time finding those strings that you almost starved to death waiting for, not to mention any number of small or obscure products that they keep in stock that wouldn't be practical for a mom and pop store. You goddamn hippie.
5) and perhaps most importantly, you chose to rant about this experience on this relatively obscure website. I'm only writing this diatribe because i'm killing time in between classes, and because I so dearly hope you read this and rethink your general attitude towards other people.

In summation, to all of you, if you don't like Guitar Center, that's cool, but keep in mind they offer hourly employees a decent wage to talk about, play with, and sell the instruments that they love. If you feel you can't support a family on that wage, then perhaps you should pursue some higher education and not work in a RETAIL STORE your whole life. Also, for the customers, GC offers a streamlined process to gain access to gear you would never even know about without them, and does it all at a ridiculously lower price than any small music store could hope to offer. I am a student, and i work at Guitar Center, and the atmosphere, combined with the skills i have learned in sales, negotiation, and most definitely my instrument are as important a part of that job to me as the pay. If all you care about is the money, then go sell weed or something.

Hey i like how you changed it to 'Shitar Center'. Cause the word shit rhymes with the first syllable of Guitar, doesn't it? That's fuckin' gold.

[anon]

To the student up above. I don't need your pathetic advise on anything. I didn't say I hated all GC just 1. You'll probably spend the rest of your life killing time. And last but most importantly your an IDIOT.

[AndrewU]

I don't really see all the problems... I work at a Guitar Center in MD, and, well, I make pretty good money. I "faded" every month so far, even my first. I'm not a top writer, either, I'm squarely in the middle of the pack each month. The customers who come back to me like me, I treat them all with respect.

I'm not out there to take your money. I'll take it if I know you're getting what you want. If I think you're buying more than what you need, I'll fucking tell you. Because:

a.) It's simple human courtesy to be honest.
b.) They may possibly even respect me even though I am a "loser 21-year old college kid who thinks he knows everything about keyboards."
c.) If you make sure they get the right thing, they won't bring it back, and you won't lose money.

Are we all like that? No.

But the ones who get to stay there are.

[BBarkerGC]

I worked at GC for almost 4 years, and let me tell you.....it's a fucking nightmare. Never have I done so much work for a company and gotten so little compensation or praise for my efforts. I didn't even sell...I worked in operations (which is the only reason I could have ever lasted there that long). All the sales people ever did was complain about their shitty pay, and believe me, it's justified. Out of all of my employees, I'd say only half of them made a commission check. Keep in mind this is a store that generates about 10-15 million dollars a year, and our average sales person takes in roughly $18-20K/yr. Fucking bullshit. I've worked there with guys who gave their lives to the fucking place only to have to move back in with their parents or live in their car because they can't make enough money to afford the essentials. Now if being a smiling corporate whore for the public isn't your style, you can always go work in operations. Wait a minute, these guys get fucked over too. The store I was in has the most inventory and the biggest warehouse in the region, and we only had two guys to operate it. TWO GUYS. The kicker here is that these guys bust their asses for $8/hr. Can you believe that shit?!?! And management will say "Well that's a fair wage....that's what all warehouse guys make." Yeah right asshole. Look at what any real warehouse pays and you'll see that you're more wrong than a Hitler loving Jew. Plain and simple, this company fucks over its employees for its own gain. It's truly disgusting. Not only do they fuck you in pay, but they're also very ethically crooked. I worked with this guy who is a District Manager named Mike Gabriel who once fired a guy for accidentally knocking his laptop over, yet this asshole once physically assaulted one of his own employees and didn't get fired. What the fuck?! That's some bullshit. The worst was what happened in January of 2004. It was Jan 15 and all of the salesmen were excited to see their nice,fat commission checks from the holiday season. Once they were handed out, everyone started to complain about how their check seemed a couple hundred bucks short. What the hell? After receiving countless complaints and probably resignations, the corporate office sent out a memo stating that they had forgotten to inform eveyone about a new form of taxation that would effect all commission-based employees. Oddly enough, the following month , the taxation was back to normal. That incident should have yielded some serious IRS investigation. Oh and how about the way they would dock you an hour if you didn't take a break? (which is completely against the law). Luckily, somebody wised up and sued them for this. I could go on and on, but I think that's enough bashing for one night. Bottom line is, NEVER EVER EVER work for GC. You'll be sorry if you do. I can't even shop there anymore because it brings back horrible memories of 65-70 hour work weeks. Boooo to GC!

[GC Dreamers]

Guitar Center's motto, as stated in the GC employee manual, states that they want employees with big dreams to sell to customers with big dreams. I'm sure that everyone here knows how to dream. With that in mind, have you ever met an "un-educated dreamer". A person that can read a classified ad that says "Make $100,000 a year, working from home on the internet" and believe that thier salary will really increase that much. Ok, now, imagine a self-taught begginner guitarist named Ben, who is about 15 years old. One day he/she walks into a guitar center, and talks to and recieves compliments from a GC salesperson. Not only does Ben recieve compliments, but the GC salesperson also tells Ben that he has toured the country, met many celebrity musicians, and knows many people in the music industry. In reality, the GC salesperson is an average musician that cannot read music, never attended college, makes minimum wage, and lives at home. The GC employee was also lying to Ben, and has also never toured, met celebrities, or been involved in the music industry. But, this GC employee, has left a major impression on Ben, and what Ben believes he needs to act like in order to be successfull in the music industry.

If that Guitar Center employee was selling a car, this kind of sales strategy, although not very ethical, would not be as bad. Because, you could always re-sell the car, and it's not like a Car Salesmen would really effect your driving technique, or lifestyle, although the product he/she sold you could.

But, selling musical instruments is an extremely important job! Because you are not just selling an instrument, but you are also helping a fellow musician. To hear that the quality of service listed above, is performed by a company as large as guitar center, a company, that has actually just bought a musical education company (name?), is not only confusing, but disturbing.

It all makes me think of one question. What's more important, the music... or the gear...?

In other words, I'm not in favor of a company that takes advantage of thier employees. Furthermore, I believe that if you shop at guitar center, you are most likely an uneducated (or just a heartless) musician, buying from an uneducated (heartless) instrument dealer.

.

[GC Dreamers]

oh yeah, I am more than positive that the musicians/celebrities do not own all, if any of the rights to any of the pictures, merch, ect... that may be in the guitar center stores. And, if they ever make appearences at guitar center, it is most likely due to thier contract with one of thier sponsors, and the fact that they are making money for thier appearence.(way more than the employees). In other words don't believe that all of the "rock legends" that have pictures in the stores are in support of guitar center. Thier pictures in guitar center, are just the same as seeing thier pictures hung up in any local music store.

thanks for your time

.

[Italics]

Hello,

I just recently started working in the Pro Audio department at a Guitar Center in my hometown (Southwest). I have spent the last five years of my life in the field of music retail, mostly at smaller "mom and pop" locations. Unlike many people posting in this forum, the pay system was adequately explained to me during my interview. However, I am suspicious that the expected results were not realistically represented.

Guitar Center's reputation certainly precedes them as being an veritable "Wal-Mart of Guitars" in this industry. Unfortunately, almost as well-known as the smiley-faced yellow guy is the history of bad business practices Wal-Mart participates in, most notably with their employees.

As a result, I accepted this job with much skepticism that despite the manager's claims I would have difficulty earning as much as I have grown accustomed to in my previous music retail jobs.

For all of you disgruntled ex (or current) Guitar Center employees: I would really like to read some hard evidence, numbers and statistics about to the general payroll system of Guitar Center. For example, a 95% turnover rate is very telling. An anecdotal argument about how "i nvr faded my pay!!1" is not.

Does anyone know where I can get a hold of this kind of data? I would be interested to know the percentage of employees (company-wide) that fade their hourly each month. I would also like to know the percentage breakdown of A, B and C level certified employees. While I'm on a roll, let's see a company-wide breakdown of Gross Sales, Gross Profits AND HOURS WORKED of employees by department. It would also be helpful to actually find documentation of official complaints filed from former employees. (That would probably be difficult to secure, I know)

Before I decide for real if this place is a joke, I want to do a little homework.

Thanks.

[Italics]

As an afterthought, I just want to add that I really resent the idea of tolerating lower pay in music retail purely because you "get to look at guitars all day."

People seem to think that anything involving music is worth doing for near-free, and that is pure, 100% overly-compromising bullshit. I feel that it is this mentality that allows many struggling, talented up-and-coming rock and roll bands to willingly play for nothing at dive bars under the guise of being paid in "exposure."

This is not a hobby. This is a job. You are not being paid to look at guitars. You are being paid to sell a product. If Guitar Center sold toilet cleanser instead of musical instruments would I suddenly be entitled to a few extra points of GP or an easier to fade draw?

Working with guitars is NOT a benefit in employment. MONEY IS A BENEFIT IN EMPLOYMENT!

[carsandguitqars]

I can appreciate all the comments on both sides of the coin here. But speaking from an older point of view you must understand the GC is a Corporation and a public one at that. Their main goal is to keep shareholders happy. Its not cushy feely, but it's just fact. Management has to keep the people with the money who invest in the company happy first. Those jobs they create at every city where they open a store, don't happen without investment. That my friends comes from every Tom Dick and Harry with an online stock account who buys 500 bucks worth of stock hoping that it will "take off". Further it also includes the big players who invest millions. Unfortunately there are very few big dollar fiscally responsible suits out there who watch out for the guy on the showroom floor. I personally think its a travesty to turnover people like that. I am a company owner and I share profits and work hard at keeping people working together with me for a long time. If I owned a Guitar Store, you would want to work for me. But owners or corporations like me are very far and few in between. You will find them in the small shops, so go there and see if you can earn more on smaller volume.

I think that a lot of the posters dissatisfaction with GC is based upon the fact that this should be a GREAT job for anyone who is a gearhead. You want so very much that not only can you get to enjoy being around what you love, but also to make a fair living at it. It's telling that even with a 95% turnover it seems that they still have a long line of people coming on board. I think you are more dissapointed than pissed.

If the job is not what its cracked up to be, then leave, by all means. We all have lost of few weeks, months, on a job that didn't turn out like we wanted. Once again the desire that the job be greater than it really is clouds your judgement.

It does tell me though that there is a lot of room for improvement and a large source of talented labor who is available for a company that wants to be the best. You just have to find that company that will hire you. In the mean time, get as much education and experience as you can. Even if it means getting it from the Big Bad Guitar Megacenter.

Knowledge is the one asset that is not subject to diminishing returns.

[this guy]

I've been reading through this post and absorbing what has been said. Many valid points on both sides. Happy GC employees satisfied and happy with thier work. Others quite the opposite. I almost hate to be this guy...almost...but, as with anything in life you get what you put into it. Should GC pay employees more? Maybe, but it seems that the people who are responsible adults can manage a life on $20k-$30k per year. Not a glamorous life. But you can put a roof over your head, buy groceries, and maybe manage an inexpensive car, with a little left over for fun. Many jobs in retail offer the same pay opportunities as GC. But, how many Mom & Pop retailers offer their employees (and their spouses!) a quite comprehensive benefits package? Do you know how much surgery costs? What if, (insert Deity here) forbid, your appendix bursts and you have emergency surgery? My wife had to have a minor surgery last year, and the bill was for $13,000. Without our benefits package, provided by Guitar Center that would have been 100% out of pocket. Rather than a much more manageable sum.

If people want to complain, let them. It's their perogative. Personally, I'm someone who feels that pissing an moaning solves nothing. If you are severely dissatisfied with your situation or feel that you have been treated unfairly, act like an adult. Suck it up and do something about it. Research it and find a solution. You are responsible for the outcomes in your life, and there comes a time when you can no longer blame all others for your missfortune.

Thanks for your time.

[momchenr]

It's funny... everyone here complaining about how little they make at GC. I've been working at GC for two years, have a decade of hands-on experience running my own studio, and am a successful salesperson. I've worked at two locations, and have seen people come and go, week after week.

The turnover rate is appalling, yes... but who are the people who end up quitting? I'll tell you...

*People who don't understand how to work in a commission-based retail job*. Listen, if your numbers are down, you need to make yourself more valuable in other ways. If you're just some chump who likes guitars and has some people skills, you're bound to get jaded... Take your role seriously, and keep in mind that the only way that you DO make money is to make it for yourself.

I hate it when people project their own failures and shortcomings onto external factors.

"It's my crappy market..."
"The Economy it down..."
"I'm still new to sales..."
"My inventory isn't stellar..."

There are successful, happy, self-motivated guys in every store, every market. It's a perfect indicator of your own durability and stamina as a sales guy that these people are down on where they work. If you're not at the top of the ranker, and you're not getting a repeat customer base...

Hating the GAME, as in GC, is just more evidence of why you didn't pan out. The most successful guys in GC don't think month-to-month, they think end-of-time... they don't think short-game, they think long-term. Everyone on here is going to claim to be a veteran salesperson - and they, even better than anyone else, should know what it takes to succeed.

GC provides a salesperson with unbelievable tools to close a deal. Everyone who works there knows this to be true. Adding knowledge, sales-prowess, and having a self-starter attitude only gives you the power to survive. Where you take it from there is all up to you, not your employer.

Take responsibility for your paycheck. Just because GC-CORP cuts the check doesn't mean you had nothing to do with the dollar value attatched to it.

[Jaded Warehouse]

I Work in operations & all you sales guys are bitching about pay. We make shit, get shit on, & do the hardest fucking work througout the store. Yet, you whiny little faggots get all the attention, awards, glory, cool gear. WE GET NADA, A FUCKING THING. Not even a good job, a pat on the back, we get MASSIVE LOADS OF GEAR IN A FUCKING STORE THAT CAN ONLY HANDLE 700,000$ WORTH OF GEAR AND WE HAVE $1.5 MILLION NOW. Thank YOU MICHEAL (District SALES MANAGER OF 200) THANK YOU FOR PULLING STRINGS MAKING OUR STORE HOLD WAY MORE INVENTORY THAN IT SHOULD. YOU SHITHEAD. Fuck this fucking company, I asked for a rasie MONTHS ago, do I get one? N0. Well fuck DJ JONES too, (DISTRICT Operations MANAGER 200) I hate this fucking company, I make shit, and get treated like shit. I should just start buying shit at wholesale cost and SELL THAT SHIT ON EBAY BABY, fuck it why not? If the corprate company can come up? Why can't we?

Oh, and never bother with calling human resources, they dont give a shit about us either. It's another corporate loop hole. I've got tons of storys, fucked up ones at that.

[Oh Please]

Dear Jaded Warehouse,
Every person that we employ gets an ANNUAL REVIEW with raises based on performance. Have you even read the employee handbook you were given when you were hired? I don't know of anyplace you can go to work and get a raise just because you WANT one.
If I had to guess I'd say that no one comes to your home and twists your arm every day forcing you to go to work at someplace you hate. Guess what? The paper is *filled* with jobs. Hate us? Quit! There are thousands of GC employees who go to work every day loving what they do. Management is filled with people, most of whom started at the bottom in warehouse and sales jobs, and loved it enough to work their way up the ladder. Maybe if you spent less time whining and more time helping your store you'd BE making more money.
Knowing how our HR Department works I can only say that if you've called them and not seen a result that made you happy it's because your complaint was probably not valid.
You sound like a very angry person. Do yourself a favor: Quit your job and go find something that makes you happy! There are people out there who want your job and would be happy doing it. Or better yet, CALL YOUR DISTRICT MANAGER DIRECTLY! I'd bet he has no idea how unhappy you are because you don't say anything when he's in your store. Who's fault is that??

[shadyfist]

I will say that there are a lot of things that Guitar Center does that I don't understand. I feel that SOME employees are underpaid, but for the most part the pay seems pretty fair. You have to realize that this type of job is not for everyone, in fact probably only a few sales people in each store are really cut out for sales.

I have worked there for 9 months and have made about 20k. In the next year I can see making anywhere from 35-40k. I was promoted to Assistant Manager last month and I work with people who are still sales guys and department managers who have been there for years.

IT'S LIKE ANY COMPANY, YOU HAVE TO EARN YOUR WAY TO THE TOP!!

I think Guitar Center just has more people that fail because they give more people a chance, even if sales may not be their thing. Eventually those who succeed... stay, and then the next group of new hires are given a chance.

Saturdays are required, which is rough, but I also make 1/5 to 1/4 of my commission on Saturdays alone.

Its definitely not a job for everyone. I would say 1 in 15 actually succeed.

I am happy with it for now

Shady-Fist

[GCGtrPro]

I work at GC in the Guitar department I write anywhere from 15 to 20k a month in profit, I watch it closely to make sure I fade my hourly cuz that's the gig. I don't make minimum wage hourly because I wouldn't work for minimum wage, I had experience before I signed on woth GC and I made them pay me because of it, but I also manage my time and my business and I sell alot of guitars, cheap ones, mid grade ones and high end ones, I do alot of deals. I am raising my 2 children and paying for my house and cars and my music collection WORKING AT GUITAR CENTER! I enjoy it. I go to work everyday and use the tools that are given to me, I talk to alot of people in a respectful manner, I do what I say I am going to do and I have a large clientelle because of it. I have never been lied to, I wasn't tricked into taking the job and I like it. If you have a bad taste in your mouth from your experience at guitar center maybe YOU didn't try to make the most of your time when you were there, maybe you treated your customers poorly, or were always on smoke breaks or flirting with girls in the store who knows, but like any commision job it is waht YOU make it. I say to most of the gripers, GROW UP, learn how to work and maybe, just maybe you can make a life for yourself. There are salesmen in this company making 85k to 100k a year selling music gear, thats awesome! If you sell 1 million dollars on a 10%/3% commision program you are gonna bring in a ton of bread. 3% of gross would be 30K and depending on your profit % which is usually between 20 and 27% that pretty large, thats 50 to 57k a year and if you do more like our top writer at my store who mad 85k last year life is good. Learn the system, WORK the system and you will succeed, I have been taught that since high school.Wake up cry babies there is no free lunch!

[chuck]

Same topic but different angle -

I don't know anyone who works (or has worked) at a GC who has the time to play in a band - even a pickup band. They are always at work because it takes lots of hours to get enough to make rent. Quite ironic since presumably anyone who would want to work at GC is probably interested in having a band or wishes to puruse music as a vocation.

I once overheard a GC store manager telling a potential employee that part of the appeal of working at GC is that one gets access to top notch equipment at discount prices and the ability to make connections withing the industry.

But intuitively none of this makes sense as most GC employees don't make a lot of money, they wouldn't have the money or time to buy and use that "top notch" gear anyway, and the only connections I see being made are with customers who pursue music recreationally. Not that there is anything wrong with that though its not like anyone ever got a record deal as a result of working at GC.

Unfortunately GC is a volume seller so they can always beat the privately owned music store (do they even exist anymore ?) any day of the week, which is why they are as big as they are. Like Walmart, GC doesn't appear to have much interest in making their stores a good place to work. This is one of the downsides of capitalism. Workers are expendable labor and nothing else. Sorry to get political but thats really the way it is. Do you think the CEO of GC really gives a damn about the problems of the average GC employee ? Of course not. He probably has contempt for them. As long as he can report profits to the share holders then thats all he cares about.

[Glarf]

Here's another angle: As a "Sales Associate" at GC, you are allowed to sell in your department, and your department only. Assistant Managers (AM's), though, can sell anywhere they want. If a customer is in my department, they're fair game. If they wander into another department, I have to leave them alone. I can get my butt chewed pretty good for trying to sell in another department. Not so for AM's. The AM's at my store sit in the middle of the store and watch for the easy meat and go for it. Sometimes they even steal customers away from Sales Associates, either by pulling us aside and sending us off on some other "critical" thing, or even more blatantly, by telling us that the customer is theirs, because they've worked with them repeatedly in the past. The store manager colludes with them, too, as he likes to see them have good numbers.

When you work sales at GC, you don't just sell stuff. Nope. You have a lot of other tasks as well -- tasks that take you off the sales floor, and away from potential customers. We're expected to stock gear during store hours. If this only meant opening a box and putting stuff out on the shelves, well, ok, I think I could deal with that. But it's much more involved than that. Much of the process of stocking the store involves time in the warehouse, time in the print room, time in the back hauling garbage and breaking down boxes. In short, a lot of time spent off the sales floor and away from potential sales. Over and over again, when I'm in the back, the Assistant Managers (AM's) are up front, grabbing the sales. Oh, and of course, AM's don't stock stuff. Ever. They don't even re-stock the items they sell. If they sell a guitar off the wall, leaving a "hole" (a big no-no in GC policy), they tell us to go find something to refill it. Meanwhile, they're looking for the next sale. Get the picture?

And when your sales are down? Management blames you for sucking at sales. There is never any acknowledgment at all that you just might be getting screwed.

The key to succeeding at GC is to be willing to hang around and put up with the abuse and the crap pay to become an Assistant Manager.

[GTRC PR]

Dear Readers,

Guitar Center would like to state that we do not maintain, reply-to or participate in any online discussions as a corporation.

Anything said by someone claiming to be a Guitar Center employee, whether Corporate or Sales, is not considered valid by Guitar Center, Inc.

For statements regarding any issues, if they are available, you must contact Guitar Center Corporate Offices in Westlake Village, CA.

Once again, this is an official posting stating that any activity by "Guitar Center Employees" on this forum, blog or any other forum and blog are NOT endorsed or approved by Guitar Center, Inc. (unless otherwise stated), and thus, may contain information that is invalid and inaccurate.

Thank you.

[SWGuy]

I'm not going to comment on the "Guitar Center sucks" war of words here. But I will point out a couple of things for all you GC (and former GC) employees.

I work in the sales department at a large single-location mail order competitor to Guitar Center, and I can shed a little light on how the business works outside of GC.

I am paid on commission, 20% of the gross profit on everything I sell. No hourly, just commission. I sold around $1.8 mil last year for around $370,000 profit, which means I made a little more money than the average sales employee at my company, but I'm not at the top - not even in the top third.

To me, it is absolutely absurd that the top salesman in the chain (or even the top in a certain territory or store) makes only $90,000. Our top guys earn double that, and we are a much smaller company than GC.

So GC employees... If you are frustrated with your current position, and if you are as good as you say you are, we have a place for you here. We have many former GC salespeople and management working on our team. You'll be appreciated, and if you really can produce the kinds of numbers you are saying, you'll be handsomely rewarded.

(If you can't, then you'll probably starve here, too. There's no hourly base, remember, only commission. If you don't sell, you don't eat.)

[2yearswasted]

Hi. Get a life. Get a real job. Be a real musician. Guitar Center is a terrible place to work. For all of you who are defending it, once you leave you will realize it. I was management. I was a top writer. And I must agree with everything these people are saying about the pay being horrible. If you are thinking about working there, please don't. Trust me.

PS: Go to Hell Tim Miller.

[Jon]

If you don't know an estimate of what you'll be getting paid before you start a job then you're a moron. And if you don't balance what you'll against your financial obligations BEFORE you start working and renting you're a bigger one still. "the stupid shall be punished". shrug

[GCNoMore]

Gotta agree with much being said here. SWGuy is right on the money. You'd don't want to work at GC. I work there now, and you bust your ass all f'in day, and don't get a lick. I've been a Dept Manager for most of the 8-10 months I've been there and the pay is just not there. Don't work here. You are seriously stupid if you do. Like any sales job, it's great around the holidays and pretty meager any other time of the year.

Not only that, but I don't care about the GAIN program. It's BS-all these great discounts? How can you buy all the gear with no money? There's no time to play in your band anyways. I don't care what advice they are providing us with, connections, blah blah blah. BS. If you don't have any time to practice with you band b/c you're at work, I don't think you're going very far.

Someone earlier brought up the Memorial Day pay. My manager (who is actually a good guy who wouldn't say something unless someone told him) said we were going to get time and a half and actually wouldn't have to fade against 3+ dollars of overtime. BS. Did we even get the time and a half for working on the holiday? NOPE. Yes, read it again....we were told we would get holiday pay, and yet WE DID NOT! This was not last year, not 3 years ago. This was this year, May 28, 2007!

PS: Hey SWguy, I know what district you worked in. ;) I know all about Tim Miller.

[Arty]

So, here I am, a very enraged employee of Guitar Center. I decided to run a Google search on the simple words " Guitar center employees ", and I was horrified to see that there are so many people who share the same story as me and everyone I work with.

I helped open this store, and I- AS WELL AS EVERYONE ELSE WHO WORKS(ed) THERE-

BUSTED MY ( our ) ASS (es ) to get that place up and going. We too were told that we'd make all this money, promised the moon and the stars in the sky, and were told we were the biggest asset of the company. As the paychecks started rolling in, I started noticing the bullshit practices GC has.

First, we were TOLD BY OUR MANAGER, all 28 of us, in one big collective group ( I say this because I want it to be known that there are witnesses, I'm not just saying this out of spite ) that we'd make an hourly wage AND commission. Well, the first pay period that we had where we could make a commission check, NO ONE DID. They then decided to tell us that " Oh yeah, you have to pay that hourly back. "

How nice of them to tell us after we put our heart and soul into that place. We have been open for a little over 3 months, and we've lost well over 80% of our original staff. Why?
Money. No one made it.

Then I hear people saying things like " Well, you must not be writing enough a month. "

BULLSHIT.

I AM selling a healthy amount, the most possible for my location. But I REFUSE... FLAT OUR REFUSE... to call my loyal customers, harass them every week, and hound people for information to make a lowly sale. And yes, you read that right... we have to call our entire list of customers every week and ask them if they got their buyers guides, tell them of new sales, so on. So, not only do we get less than nothing, we are now telemarketers, too. We were told stories about management beating up employees and not getting fired, " losers " suing for their pay that was docked, and some other rather interesting stories I'm not at liberty to post up here. But we stuck through it, remained faithful, and they stabbed us in the back. I think it was right around when my manager told me to " Shut the fuck up! " that I lost my tolerance with this place.

Why was I told to shut the fuck up?
Because it was the night before the Memorial Day Sale, and we were all there doing this piss ant work, setting up for the next day. We were all there for more than 12 hours, and worn rather thin. We had to make a trash run. Out of 11 people working that night, FOUR were out running garbage. In the rain. And I was told to " Jump on it to make room for more. " I was ordered by my store manager to jump on wet garbage in a dumpster, while everyone else watched the four of us work. I was fed up, and was speaking my mind about it- something I'm not afraid to do, and am known for doing- and was told to shut the fuck up. Upon asking WHY, my manager explained to me that the reason we weren't making our sales goals was because of my department. See what happened? They talked shit, I stuck up for myself, and was blamed for everything.

Oh, AND They promised that NO ONE from other stores would be brought down to ours to be managers. Because " We built the place!!! "

Guess what... ALL OF THE AMS ARE FROM OTHER STORES!!!
And not ONE person from the original crew is an AM.

I'm rambling now, but I've had it. I'm looking for another job, and I hope that this page will help possible new hires for GC to realize that this job will destroy you.

( Oh, and it would be really easy for the company to figure out who I am by reading this. Do you think I care? Not at all. I hope they fire me, it'll be like the world being lifted from my shoulders. )

[GCNoMore]

Damn Arty,

I feel for you man. You guys have it even worse seeing as how you had to open a store and you don't get the same traffic flow of an established store. Even then, it's not like you are going to make
any money, lol. I can tell you that first hand. But damn, they want you to jump in the dumpster? That's just ridiculous! What are you, some slave or something?

Hang in there man, and keep looking for another job. I'm doing the same. AIM me at GuitarDreamer131 if ya want to talk GC.

Just curious, any one else get paid time and a half for Memorial Day?

[Arty]

" Even then, it's not like you are going to make
any money, lol. "

" What are you, some slave or something? "

Precisely my point. I've said these two things myself, over and over again. And NO, NO ONE made time and a half that Memorial Day. It was very slow, too.

It's sad, it really is...
I have the time of my life there with the people I work with. But; the job itself stresses me out to the point of keeping me awake at night, and I've got to ration which bills to pay this time around, just so I can have money left over to live off of. My car has a massive amount of electrical problems, and I can't afford to get them fixed, because I don't make nearly enough money.

I even still owe the guy I bought the car off of money! DO you know how that makes me feel?! I'm working as hard as I can, and I can't even repay this man who helped me in ways no one else would have dared.

[Haha]

Well Guitar Center has now been bought out by Bain Group.

This is the same group of fuckwads who ruined burger king, toys r us, etc etc.

See ya GC!

[GCNoMore]

LOL! I don't know if this is a good thing or bad thing for GC, but it's certainly interesting! I heard from my manager that we might get paid more now...I was like, when? Oh well it won't take place until December or there after...HA. Yeah ok! I've been promised so many things at GC and they've never delivered I'm sure as hell not gonna wait around for that! LOL! These guys crack me up!

[Wow]

Wow is all I can say. A year or more of rants against Guitar Center that I give many, many kudos to. I'm currently working for this wonderful society, and while I love my job, I hate it even more. 4 years of the Air Force lead me to realize I'd rather be back in Iraq than to continue working for GC.

[fffff]

based on the unfulfilled promises that gc has handed out in the last year ive worked there, i doubt anything like that will change. if we do go to standardized wages (which im praying for, to not fall flat each month) then im sure theyll find some new way to fuck us, and gain more profit for upper management. I LOVE the company and what it does and the crews at different stores and helping customers out and get them into what they really need to get into, rather than what gps more, but there are some HUGE drawbacks that keep me under the poverty line. It really is depressing, and i hope things get better. I predict that gc will smarten up about these things, but how long until then is a question that will stay on our minds for a long while...

[Satisfied Ex-GC]

Boys and girls, hyperemotionalism will get you nowhere in life. If you work for any job and don't like it, you should do what normal adults do, and find a new one. Here are a few points to consider:

1. Guitar Center is a very fun place to work. You have to understand that sometimes you have to fight to enjoy your job. This means taking action against a manager who would tell you to 'shut the fuck up'.
2. Not taking action where action is needed is your fault. Guitar Center has a very strict HR division. Your victimization only really appeals to other victims in this case.
3. Guitar Center indeed underpays their employees. This isn't a debatable statement. If you compare annual salaries of similar profit output from any other comissioned retail environment, you would see a noticable difference. This applies to everyone in the company, not just salesmen.
4. The majority of happy people have realized that money does not equal happiness. Most people take huge paycuts to work in the field they want to work in. Their overall quality of life goes up, even though their yearly income goes down.
5. If you can't even outwrite minimum wage, you should dig deep and be humble enough to realize that sales is not for you.
6. If resorting to hate fueled obscenity is your best idea to communicate your frustration, I have news for you: Until you make a decision to proactively interact with your environment rather than being a product of it, you will fail in any endeavor.
7. Failing does nothing for you, but everything for forward thinking people. You're at the bottom of the food chain.
8. Making the decision to be ok with mediocrity seems to be the fad these days. The humane side of me truly wishes you guys would wake up and do something about your lack of drive, but the competitive side of me hopes you remain apathetic and victimized so I will look better to prospective employers.

Satisfied Ex-GC,

I most certainly respect your opinion, but I must make some counterpoints to what you have said.

-Guitar Center IS a fun place to work. I don't think anyone denies that. What could be more fun if you are a musician? You get to work around the gear you play and dream about having all day. It SHOULD be a terrific job. But...it's not...

-You say that Guitar Center underpays their employees and that isn't debatable. I don't think anyone is disagreeing with you there. However, then you go on to say that well sometimes to do the job you want, you have to take a pay cut. You make it sound as though it's OK for GC to do what they do. That's completely absurd. Musicians already are not people who tend to have a lot of money, so tell ya what, let's take them in, promise them the world, and then when they work their asses off, stab them in the back by giving them lousy pay and make them feel lousy about themselves so that they'll work even harder next time around. That's exactly what GC does. You are correct in saying that a lot of people do take less pay to do what they want in life, but what GC does is above and beyond that. It's completely and utterly ridiculous. We aren't talking about $40,000 a year vs. making $50,000 or even $60,000 where you in both cases already making a decent living, enough to support yourself. We're talking more like sometimes hovering around $20,000...where you are on that borderline of barely being able to eat and just get by.

-It's not that hard to outwrite minimum wage. I've done it many times in the year I have worked there. However, even when you do, when you look at the number of hours you had to work, the extra time and effort and hard work you put in, your pay check just doesn't justify it. You don't feel fairly compensated. I'm not asking for the world, something ridiculous like $50,000 a year to be a dept manager. But you mean to tell me they couldn't pay someone a base wage + commission, as oppo